{The List-} Civilizations

[yellfromhell]

Hi,

People are arguing all the time about including Israel, Siamese, Huns, Etiopeans, and so on.
Does anyone remember a continent called South America? It seems we do not exist: accept we are not developed countries but at least consider us as exotic. Not even this is shown in your choices. It looks like we can be summarized with the Inca civ.
There are lots of proposed civs that were undeveloped ones, and some Conquests civs too. So, if some feels the need to build a global representative Civ4 game, then, at least, include 1 more South American civ: ex: brazileans, argentineans, araucans, guaranis, onas... The same should go for Caribean region (not Central America), ex: cubans, caribes...
O.K... maybe we wont be remembered as part of the world´s vanguard, but i look to other civs that are remembered and dont meet that minimun and I get confused.
About Splitting: everytime you talk about civ splitting you mention that the Spaniards should be able to split into Argentine, Mexico, Peru, Chile,... Good Idea, but then no Argentine, Mexican or Peruvian Civ could start the game. You also say that the English should be able to split into American, South-African, Aussies,... but again, no American, South-African or Australian Civ could start the game. Before talking about names we should solve this paradox or contradiction first, dont you think?
Hugs

[Heresson]

South America should be civless so that Europeans could colonise it!

[Max Sinister]

Sorry, I don't like the idea that specific civs can split off from other civs. Do we have to start every game in 4000BC with Babylonians and Chinese only, then? Why can't we have a fictitious civ that would've emerged if the Italians had had a big American colony? What happens if the split-of civs will split again? The idea is still interesting, but we need better solutions...

[yellfromhell]

(Max Sinister) "Why can't we have a fictitious civ that would've emerged if the Italians had had a big American colony? What happens if the split-of civs will split again?"

Its O.K. No problem with fictitious civs emerging from fictitious colonies. But then we cannot use the real world to judge whether a civ deserves to be in civ4 or not. If we use fictitious civs, there would be no excuse to exclude a real civ form civ4

[Quezacotl06]

You know how the sedentiary barbarians have names for their villages that are minor civilizations of that cultural group? Breakaway civilizations (which would only happen to cities that are far away and/or have large ethnic splits) could just be given names and such from a certain group in that culture. China could have breakaways that become the indonesians, the vietnamese, the tai, the mongolians. French breakaways could become the Belgium, Denmark, Switzerland, Slovakia, etc.

It's still centered around having culturaly-linked groups of people, while still having noone singled out. Also, I think breakaway civs should get a "breakaway" civ trait, which means all villages get extra food/shields/commerce/culture until they reach size 7, and then only extra culture until they reach size 13. So they can catch up to other civs quickly. Cause it honesly is not fair if ur competing with others who've had like a 150 year head start.

[Quezacotl06]

A solution I thought up was to have your civilization made by punching in a few things

*ENTER CULTURE: American
*ENTER TRAITS: Industrial, Agricultural

After that, a little database flips open, and then you can select which american civlization you want, which just loads your unit, your leader's portrait (please be just a picture, the leaders moving their faces back and forth looking displeased or turned on REALY was not worth the loss in design flexibility), and city names, and battle/science leaders.

But if you choose a culture and a set of traits, it automaticaly selects a match for you, and you can choose if you want it or not. If you enter European and Commerce/Seafaring, the option to select the English pops right up, or you can flip through other civ names. Maybe you wanna be Irish, or Welsche, or the Swiss? You shouldn't be able to select a nation outside of a cultural group, though. You gotta keep some of the solidarity of regional ethnic/culturaly linked starts.

[Brent]

Breakaway Trait: good idea.

Other idea: could be particularly good if there are so many civs available that they need to be narrowed down. Would be nice to be able to edit city lists in setup too. And be able to use setup like an editor in creating new civs to use again later.

[Heresson]

Slovakians should be Polish breakaways, with Ukrainians, Russians, Czechs and Germans...

[Xorbon]

Originally posted by panag
hi ,
here is a short list , ...

Here is a capsule of accomplishments you may not be fully aware of. I thought you might find these statistics interesting.

...yadda, yadda, yadda...

...midget date palms...

...blah, blah, blah...

have a nice day

(I know this is a fairly old post, but...)

I'm all for adding Israel as a civ, though I'd give it a ranking of between 30 and 40 in terms of priority. In addition, I would not include it because of the accomplishments of the modern state. The modern state of Israel is quite insignificant with respect to history as a whole. If you're going to include Israel because of its modern achievements, you'd have to include countries such as Brazil, Canada, and Australia as well.

Instead of the modern state, I'd look at the ancient kingdoms of Israel and Judah. These kingdoms lasted about 500 years; modern Israel isn't quite 60 years old yet.

[Quezacotl06]

I think the database idea and the ability to edit civ city names and such would be good.
- Can have large variety of civs., there will be something for everyone
- No signaling out others as being insignificant. Israel and Canada in mind (my own ignorant patriotic mind). Because history could have certainly changed to make Canada (Or Mexico, or Brazil) the dominant American civilization.
- Easier to have breakaway colonies, when a database of their names already exists of their information. Once again, no signaling out of any particular nation as being vulnerable to insurrection.

Granted, it would require more work, but less time on each civ could be done. 2d portrait, briefer historical background, stuff like that. Stuff that I really did not care for when I first found it.